We Are Not the First Civilization to Collapse, But We Will Probably Be the Last?

Old Worldwide Church of God booklet

Are the USA and its British-descended allies a modern version of Rome that is declining?

Chris Hedges reported the following:

We Are Not the First Civilization to Collapse, But We Will Probably Be the Last

I look out from the structure—-known as Monks Mound — at the flatlands below, with smaller mounds dotting the distance. These earthen mounds, built at a confluence of the Illinois, Mississippi and Missouri rivers, are all that remain of one of the largest pre-Columbian settlements north of Mexico, occupied from around 800 to 1,400 AD by perhaps as many as 20,000 people.

This great city, perhaps the greatest in North America, rose, flourished, fell into decline and was ultimately abandoned. Civilizations die in familiar patterns. They exhaust natural resources. They spawn parasitic elites who plunder and loot the institutions and systems that make a complex society possible. They engage in futile and self-defeating wars. And then the rot sets in. The great urban centers die first, falling into irreversible decay. Central authority unravels. Artistic expression and intellectual inquiry are replaced by a new dark age, the triumph of tawdry spectacle and the celebration of crowd-pleasing imbecility.

“Collapse occurs, and can only occur, in a power vacuum,” anthropologist Joseph Tainter writes in The Collapse of Complex Societies. “Collapse is possible only where there is no competitor strong enough to fill the political vacuum of disintegration.” …

“Just as in the past, countries that are environmentally stressed, overpopulated, or both, become at risk of getting politically stressed, and of their governments collapsing,” Jared Diamond argues in Collapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed. “When people are desperate, undernourished and without hope, they blame their governments, which they see as responsible for or unable to solve their problems. They try to emigrate at any cost. They fight each other over land. They kill each other. They start civil wars. They figure that they have nothing to lose, so they become terrorists, or they support or tolerate terrorism.” …

The more insurmountable the crisis becomes, the more we, like our prehistoric ancestors, will retreat into self-defeating responses, violence, magical thinking and denial. 08/14/22 https://chrishedges.substack.com/p/we-are-not-the-first-civilization?utm_source=twitter&sd=pf

There will be many denials, but the USA will fall like ancient civilizations–though it will not be the last as Babylon the Great will be and it will fall per Revelation 18.

There are also similarities to ancient Rome:

Are we ‘Rome’? The question has weighed heavily on the minds of American conservatives, libertarians and Catholics at their various conferences. Is America headed the way of the Roman empire? Bureaucratic decay, massive public debt, an overstretched military, a political system seemingly incapable of responding to challenges – “the late Roman empire suffered these maladies, and so, some fear, does contemporary America”, notes The American Conservative, a journal which has been pursuing this ‘line’ diligently, and with a growing constituency, over a number of years. (Note that this is not the constituency of Vice-President Pence who represents an Evangelical, fundamentalist, literal insistence on imminent Redemption, with its ‘Rapture’ politics).

The American Conservative rather warns:

“If libertarians on the Right worry about structural collapse – cultural and religious conservatives add a moral and spiritual dimension to the debate. Rising hedonism, waning religious observance, ongoing break-up of the family, and a general loss of cultural coherence — to traditionalists, these are signs of a possible Dark Age ahead”.

… “For MacIntyre”, Rod Dreher, the author of The Benedict Option writes: “we too are living through a Fall of Rome-like catastrophe, one that is concealed by our liberty and prosperit”. Dreher continues, “In his influential 1981 book, After Virtue, MacIntyre argued that the Enlightenment project cut Western man off from his roots in tradition, but failed to produce a binding morality based on Reason alone. Plus, the Enlightenment extolled the autonomous individual. Consequently, we live in a culture of moral chaos and fragmentation in which many questions are simply impossible to settle. MacIntyre says that our contemporary world is a dark wood, and that finding our way back to the straight path will require establishing new forms of community”.

“The “Benedict Option” thus refers to [those] in contemporary America who cease to identify the continuation of civility and moral community with the maintenance of American Empire, and who therefore are keen to construct local forms of community as loci of Christian resistance against what the Empire represents. Put less grandly, the Benedict Option — or ‘Ben Op’ — is an umbrella term for Christians [and American conservatives], who accept MacIntyre’s critique of modernity”. …

What is so interesting to an outsider, is how the Ben Op’s author, Dreher, situates it within the US political context:

“Many of us on the Right who have been dismayed by the Trumpening (sic), and have been hard hit by the Kavanaugh debacle, have concluded that [nonetheless], we have no choice but to vote Republican this November – if only out of self-defense. (He refers to November 2018)

“But let me quote two passages from The Benedict Option:

“The cultural Left—which is to say, the American mainstream— has no intention of living in post-war peace. It is pressing forward with a harsh, relentless occupation, one that is aided by the cluelessness of Christians [i.e. those mirroring liberalism], who don’t understand what’s happening. Don’t be fooled: the upset presidential victory of Donald Trump has at best given us a bit more time to prepare for the inevitable (emphasis added).

[Those] who believe that politics alone will be sufficient – are not going to be prepared for what’s going to come when the Republicans lose the White House and/or Congress, which is inevitable. Our politics have become so sulfurous that there will be a vicious backlash, and that backlash will fall primarily on social and religious conservatives. When the Democrats regain power, conservative Christians are going to be in very bad shape”.

The Ben Op, in other words, is another important window into what Professor Mike Vlahos has described as the gathering, next chapter to America’s unresolved ‘civil war’: “America today fissuring into two visions of the nation’s future way of life: “Red” virtue imagines a continuity of family and community within a publicly affirmed national community. “Blue” virtue imagines personally chosen communities mediated through the individual’s relationship with the state. So, even though these two divided visions of America have been opposed for decades, and so far have controlled the urge to violence, there is in their bitter contest [of today] a sense of gathering movement toward an ultimate decision”.

“Today, two righteous paths are gridlocked in opposition … Red and Blue already represent an irreparable religious schism, deeper in doctrinal terms even than the 16th-century Catholic-Protestant schism. The war here, is over which faction successfully captures the (social media) flag, as true inheritor of American virtue. Both perceive themselves as champions of national renewal, of cleansing corrupted ideals, and of truly fulfilling America’s promise. Both fervently believe that they alone – own virtue.” https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2019/03/04/us-conservatives-pursue-ben-option-global-ramification.html

The US is a house divided and will fall, even worse than ancient Rome did. The UK has Brexit and other troubles. Canada, Australia, and New Zealand are having issues as well.

As far as some attitudes in modern society, notice also something earlier from the following by Charles Hugh Smith:

Are We Fiddling While Rome Burns?

Solutions abound, but they require the retirement of obsolete systems that defend entrenched interests and soul-crushing inequalities.

It turns out Nero wasn’t fiddling as Rome burned–he was 60 km away at the time. Did Nero Really Fiddle While Rome Burned?

The story has become short-hand for making light of a catastrophe, either out of self-interest (one theory had Nero clearing a site he desired for a palace with the fire) or out of a mad detachment from reality.

Are we fiddling while Rome burns? I would say yes–because we’re not solving any of the structural problems that are dooming the status quo. Instead, we’re allowing a corrupt, corporate mainstream media to distract us with fake “Russians hacked our election” hysteria, false “cultural war” mania, and a laughably Orwellian frenzy over fake news which magically avoids mentioning the propaganda narratives pushed 24/7 by the mainstream media–narratives that are the acme of fake news.

The media is only half the problem, of course; the audience doesn’t want to hear about structural problems that can only be fixed by disrupting the status quo. If we don’t accept that the financial system we inhabit is imploding, maybe all the problems will go away.

The system is coughing up blood and we still want to believe it is “recovering” from a cold.

Here’s a short list of structural problems we should be tackling:

1. Soaring inequality and the institutionalization of economic privilege. …
2. The central state (government) has one default setting: endless expansion into every nook and cranny of daily life. …
3. Finance has detached from the real-world economy, distorting every function via financialization, which concentrates income and wealth in the hands of the few. …
4. Our educational system is obsolete but the the current system is incapable of transformation for structural reasons. …
5. The economy and thus our society (i.e. our mode of production) are changing beneath our feet in dramatic ways. …

Denial won’t fix what’s broken, and neither will magical thinking (the economy is “recovering,” symbolic gestures and virtue-signaling will fix everything, etc.) Clinging to the absurd hope that the status quo just has a nagging cold will only increase the disorder when the system breaks down. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-08-22/are-we-fiddling-while-rome-burns

While there are structural problems in the USA, it is the cause that needs to be dealt with. This is something that Charles Hugh Smith did not truly address.

Decades ago, the old Worldwide Church of God put out an article about similarities between ancient Rome and the USA and UK:

The FIVE MAJOR CAUSES for the collapse of the Roman Empire are rife in modern America and Britain. Tragically, modern man has not learned from historical mistakes. Millions today believe America is too big, too powerful, and too wealthy to suffer a similar fate. But the cold facts present a bleak warning — a warning we simply must not ignore!

“Ho, ho!” they laughed at the warnings of Seneca. “Rome fall? Never!”

To Roman citizens living in the glitter of empire — enjoying an explosive frenzy of building, with huge cities, bejeweled with rising marble columns, with paved, pleasant tree-lined avenues and rushing fountains; seeing the victory parades through triumphal arches of yet additional conquests; hearing of the exploits of this or that great general — Rome was impregnable. She was the world — and the world was Rome.

To speculate for one brief moment that all this could soon collapse — that the ravages of wars, taxation, mounting crime, race riots, subversion from within, political assassinations, natural disasters and public apathy would one day bring Rome to utter collapse and ruin, was not only unimaginable to them — it was folly to the heights of idiocy.

And to millions of American and British people today — the thought that America and Britain could suffer a similar fate — though with more modern consequences — seems equally ludicrous.

But Rome fell. …

The Five Major Causes

The five major causes for the decline and fall of the Roman Empire deduced from the writings of Edward Gibbon and noted historians of the Roman world are these: (1) The BREAKDOWN OF THE FAMILY and the rapid increase of DIVORCE. (2) The spiraling rise of TAXES and EXTRAVAGANT SPENDING. (3) The MOUNTING CRAZE FOR PLEASURE and the brutalization of sports. (4) The mounting production of ARMAMENTS to fight ever-increasing threats of enemy attacks. (5) The DECAY OF RELIGION into myriad and confusing forms, leaving the people without a uniform guide. (Armstrong GT, Hogberg G. The MODERN ROMANS – PART I. Plain Truth, August 1969)

Writes historian William Stearns Davis in his book, The Influence of Wealth in Imperial Rome, pages 163, 164, 167:

“As an almost unavoidable corollary of the huge Roman fortunes, went the accumulation of huge debts… Even men of grave and respectable habits caught the mania of their age, that of living beyond their incomes…

“The typical Roman of birth and fashion [the upper class — like average Americans today], may then be imagined as regularly in debt, and frequently on the brink of ruin.”

Mania of Our Age, Too

Total debt in the United States, both public and private, stands at an astronomical 1.6 trillion dollars!

This enormous sum is double what it was only ten years ago. Armstrong GT, Hogberg G. The MODERN ROMANS – PART II. Plain Truth, September 1969)

IF the dollar is devalued, INFLATION will almost surely result — and eventual economic COLLAPSE for the United States.

Those of you who truly BELIEVE the prophecies of your Bible KNOW such economic collapse is prophesied to happen! (Armstrong HW. Co-worker Letter, March 26, 1968)

Rome collapsed under the crushing twin burdens of confiscatory taxation and creeping inflation. The steady deterioration of Rome’s currency was symptomatic of the increasingly serious financial situation of the empire.

But note this: What “average” pleasure-oriented Roman, living for the day, ever dreamed his proud nation would someday collapse into ignominy and be remembered only in the past tense in the pages of history?

There were those who warned the Romans of the inevitable end of their ways. Rome had its prophets, its seers, its political satirists. But their combined “jeremiad” fell on deaf ears. Romans, as a whole, would not listen.

And Rome fell.

Americans, Britons, Canadians, Australians, South Africans — as a whole — are not listening to the veritable torrent of shouts and warnings trumpeted by leaders in all aspects of national life.

Will our nations also fall?

The total official debt of the US government is over USD$34 trillion now. This massive debt cannot continue indefinitely–and as we are seeing interest rates rise, this will further stress the USA’s finances until it is too late (cf. Habakkuk 2:6-8).

Debt is a consequence of sin and is a curse:

43 The alien who is among you shall rise higher and higher above you, and you shall come down lower and lower. 44 He shall lend to you, but you shall not lend to him; he shall be the head, and you shall be the tail. 45 Moreover all these curses shall come upon you and pursue and overtake you, until you are destroyed…47 “Because you did not serve the LORD your God with joy and gladness of heart, for the abundance of everything, 48 therefore you shall serve your enemies, whom the LORD will send against you, in hunger, in thirst, in nakedness, and in need of everything; and He will put a yoke of iron on your neck until He has destroyed you. 49 The LORD will bring a nation against you from afar, from the end of the earth, as swift as the eagle flies, a nation whose language you will not understand, 50 a nation of fierce countenance, which does not respect the elderly nor show favor to the young. 51 And they shall eat the increase of your livestock and the produce of your land, until you are destroyed; they shall not leave you grain or new wine or oil, or the increase of your cattle or the offspring of your flocks, until they have destroyed you. 52 They shall besiege you at all your gates until your high and fortified walls, in which you trust, come down throughout all your land; and they shall besiege you at all your gates throughout all your land which the LORD your God has given you (Deuteronomy 28:42-45,47-52).

Increased acceptance and participation of sin and greed is the real structural cause of what will lead to the end of the USA. Abortion, pornography, sexual immorality, a disdain for scripture, etc. are major problems that are leading to bad political and other decisions.

This will not end well for the USA or its Anglo-Saxon descended allies (Jeremiah 30:7; Daniel 8:24-25; 11:39).

After I initially made the above post, I saw the following:

January 24, 2022

Pessimism in America has gone mainstream, according to a new NBC News poll.

Between a senile teleprompter president who recently admitted he can’t in fact ‘shut down’ Covid as promised, rampant inflation causing real wages to stagnate, and ongoing division over everything from election integrity to pandemic mandates to what’s being taught in schools, Americans have become extremely sour on the future – less than 10 months before midterm elections. …

“Downhill, divided, doubting democracy, falling behind, and tuning out — this is how Americans are feeling as they’re heading into 2022,” said Democratic pollster Jeff Horwitt of Hart Research Associates, who conducted the survey with conservative pollster Bill McInturff of Public Opinion Strategies.

The poll has “President Joe Biden’s approval ratings remaining in the low 40s, Republicans holding a double-digit edge in enthusiasm and key Democratic groups losing interest in the upcoming election.”

On the economy, while job creation is up and the unemployment rate is down, 61 percent of respondents in the poll say their family’s income is falling behind the cost of living.

That’s compared with 30 percent who say they’re staying about even and 7 percent who say their income is going up faster than the cost of living. –NBC News …

When it comes to national policies – 70% say America is so polarized that it can no longer solve major issues – and that the division will only continue to grow. 27% on the other hand feel that America always overcomes its differences to solve the greatest challenges. In 2010, 50% of those polled said America ‘always comes together,’ and 45% said political differences would continue to grow. https://www.zerohedge.com/political/dark-outlook-dismal-nbc-poll-reveals-most-americans-think-country-going-downhill-and-lost

Yes, more and more in the USA see decline and division.

Whether or not they believe in the Bible, the reality is that the Great Tribulation is coming (Matthew 24:21)–and the USA will be greatly troubled by it (Jeremiah 30:7).–to the point it will be conquered and its lands divided (cf. Daniel 11:39).

While national repentance could delay that, such repentance is not expected (Hosea 11:3a, 5b-7). Though you personally can repent (Acts 17:30).

As it turns out, Jesus does offer a way out, prior to the establishment of the Kingdom of God, for certain Christians:

7 “And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write,

‘These things says He who is holy, He who is true, “He who has the key of David, He who opens and no one shuts, and shuts and no one opens”: 8 “I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. 9 Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie — indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. 10 Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. 11 Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. 12 He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name. (Revelation 3:7-12)

To overcome includes changing yourself. Philadelphia means “love of the brethren.” Philadelphians need to do more than worry about themselves, they need to follow the lead of Jesus to support going through the open door of proclaiming the good news of the Kingdom of God to the world as a witness (Matthew 24:14).

It is ONLY the Philadelphian Christians that Jesus makes that promise of protection to. Other Christians at the end will face Satan’s wrath (cf. Revelation 12:17).

Sadly, like the unconverted in the USA and its Anglo-Saxon descended allies, most Christians do not see that they need to change much or do much now. They are essentially fiddling away their opportunity to build the type of giving and loving character that they should. Instead they tend to falsely believe that they will see what it happening before it is too late and will react then. That is wrong for many reasons (some are in the article The Laodicean Church Era).

That said, the civilization that defeats the USA and its British-descended allies will be defeated and collapse as well.

But they will not be the last to be eliminated–more on that can be found in the free online book: Lost Tribes and Prophecies: What will happen to Australia, the British Isles, Canada, Europe, New Zealand and the United States of America?

But the GOOD NEWS is that it will be replaced by the millennial Kingdom of God once Jesus returns.

Some items of possibly related interest may include:

Lost Tribes and Prophecies: What will happen to Australia, the British Isles, Canada, Europe, New Zealand and the United States of America? Where did those people come from? Can you totally rely on DNA? What about other peoples? Do you really know what will happen to Europe and the English-speaking peoples? What about Africa, Asia, South America, and the Islands? This free online book provides scriptural, scientific, historical references, and commentary to address those matters. Here are links to related sermons: Lost tribes, the Bible, and DNA; Lost tribes, prophecies, and identifications; 11 Tribes, 144,000, and Multitudes; Israel, Jeremiah, Tea Tephi, and British Royalty; Gentile European Beast; Royal Succession, Samaria, and Prophecies; Asia, Islands, Latin America, Africa, and Armageddon; When Will the End of the Age Come?; Rise of the Prophesied King of the North; Christian Persecution from the Beast; WWIII and the Coming New World Order; and Woes, WWIV, and the Good News of the Kingdom of God.
Is God Calling You? This booklet discusses topics including calling, election, and selection. If God is calling you, how will you respond? Here is are links to related sermons: Christian Election: Is God Calling YOU? and Predestination and Your Selection. A short animation is also available: Is God Calling You?
Christian Repentance Do you know what repentance is? Is it really necessary for salvation? Two related sermons about this are also available: Real Repentance and Real Christian Repentance.
Just What Do You Mean — Repentance? Do you know what repentance is? Have you truly repented? Repented of what? Herbert W. Armstrong wrote this as a booklet on this important subject.
When You Sin: Do You Really Repent? This is an article by Charles F. Hunting. A related sermon is Confess to God and truly repent.
Zephaniah’s ‘Gather Together’ Prophecy Is it safe to be ‘independent’ or in a non-Philadelphin Church of God? What did God inspire Zephaniah to write?
COVID 19 is NOT the End, but could it be TEOTWAWKI? The novel coronavirus called COVID-19 is wreaking havoc around the world. Many states of the USA as well as countries in Europe are on lockdown with shelter in place /shelter in residence requirements. In France, a form is required when you are not at your house. In Spain, drones are being used to warn people who are outside to got back to their homes–does that bring up feelings of ‘Big Brother’? Italy, France, and other areas are using police and/or military force to encourage people to stay inside. According to the Bible could this be the end? If not, what has to happen first? Have the second and third of the four horsemen of the Apocalypse started their ride? Could COVID-19 be the fourth horseman? Why or why not? Could we be seeing The End of the World as We Know It (TEOTWAWKI) like the R.E.M.’s 1987 single song discussed? Do Christians need to fear? What did Jesus teach? What did the Psalmist teach? This is a video. Here is a link to a version in the Spanish language: Corona 19 no es el final PERO es el TEOTWAWKI.
There is a Place of Safety for the Philadelphians. Why it May Be Petra This article discusses a biblical ‘place of safety’ and includes quotes from the Bible and Herbert W. Armstrong on this subject–thus, there is a biblically supported alternative to the rapture theory. There is also a video on the subject: Might Petra be the Place of Safety? Here is something related in the Spanish language: Hay un lugar de seguridad para los Filadelfinos. ¿Puede ser Petra?
Is There A Secret Rapture for the Church? When and Where is the Church Protected? What does the Bible really teach? Does the Church flee or is it taken up just prior to the great tribulation? Who really is left behind? There is also a YouTube video with information Did Jesus Teach a Pre-tribulation Rapture?
World War III: Steps in Progress Are there surprising actions going on now that are leading to WWIII? Might a nuclear attack be expected? Does the Bible promise protection to all or only some Christians? How can you be part of those that will be protected? A related video would be Is World War III About to Begin? Can You Escape?
The Sardis Church Era was predominant circa 1600 A.D. to circa 1933 A.D. Discusses early history of the Seventh Day Baptists, Seventh-day Adventists, and COG-7th Day.
The Philadelphia Church Era was predominant circa 1933 A.D. to 1986 A.D. The old Radio Church of God and old Worldwide Church of God, now the remnant of that era is basically the most faithful in the Church of God, like who hold to the beliefs and practices of the Continuing Church of God.
The Laodicean Church Era has been predominant circa 1986 A.D. to present. The Laodiceans are non-Philadelphians who mainly descended from the old WCG or its offshoots. They do not properly understand the work or biblical prophecies and will face the Great Tribulation if they do not repent.
Laodicean Warning for God’s People Is there really a place of safety? Do God’s people need to be warned? Warned for what?
The Final Phase of the Work What is the final phase of the work? Who will lead it? Do you have the courage to support it? Here is a related YouTube video titled The Final Phase of the Work. The written article has been translated into Spanish La Fase Final de la Obra.