PCG and LCG are confused about the sequence in Daniel 11

Battle Involving the 4th Islamic Caliphate

Nearly all who are part of the improperly named Philadelphia Church of God (PCG) and Living Church of God (LCG) believe that their leaders understand end time prophecy.

Yet, the reality is that on many prophetic points the teachings of those groups are confused or otherwise in error. Some of their errors have to do with Daniel 11.

While many are aware of Gerald Flurry’s identification of Iran as the final “King of the South,” some may be surprised to realize that both PCG and LCG do not understand the proper sequence of Daniel 11 and the timing of the attacks by the King of the North.

What do they teach?

Let’s start with PCG.

In the January 2004 issue of the Philadelphia Trumpet, PCG’s Gerald Flurry wrote:

““And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over. He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon” (Dan. 11:40-41). The king of the north is a united Europe, and the king of the south is radical Islam led by Iran…Europe will win this war. But that victory will trigger some other events. Europe will then ally itself with the moderate Arabs and attack America, Britain and the nation called Israel.

Many Bible prophecies thunder that truth. (Flurry G. Personal: Russia Frightens Europe— and Fulfills Bible Prophecy. Philadelphia Trumpet, January 2004).

However, this sequence is in error. The Bible shows that the coming King of the North will eliminate the USA (the land with the strongest fortresses) in Daniel 11:39. This comes before the destruction of the King of the South in Daniel 11:40-43 (for more details, please check out Who is the King of the North?).

Similarly to PCG, notice what LCG’s Dr. Roderick C. Meredith wrote and published:

This great charismatic “Mahdi” (Messiah) will gather together the forces of Islam in a final jihad (holy war) against the morally corrupt nations of the West, whose religion, lifestyle and values represent a deadly challenge to the Islamic dream.

He will feel emboldened to provoke or attack the European Union (Daniel 11:40). This will anger the fierce “king of the North” and the forces of the king of the South will be completely crushed by this European power. The king of the North will then come down “like a whirlwind” (v. 40) and take over the Middle East, including the Holy Land (vv. 41–42). The king of the North’s armies will seize control of the region’s vast oil reserves (v. 43).

These soon-to-happen events will be awesome to witness. The “king of the North,” a future European Napoleon or Hitler type of powerful, dynamic leader, will react mightily with a blitzkrieg retaliation. This dramatic military response against the king of the South will set off a chain of other events.

“And they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation” (Daniel 11:31). As this dual prophecy shows, there will, at the end of this age, either be a temple or a special altar in Jerusalem. The priests of the family of Aaron will again offer the daily animal sacrifices prescribed in the Old Testament until a great military power comes in and places there what is called the abomination of desolation.

The description continues: “At that time Michael shall stand up, the great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people; and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation, even to that time” (Daniel 12:1). This is talking about the American, British Commonwealth and Jewish peoples. The great Muslim “king of the South” will cause a war, and the European “king of the North” will conquer much of the Middle East. This king of the North also comes west against God’s people at the beginning of the Great Tribulation. This is the same time Jesus described in Matthew 24:21: “For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be.” (Meredith RC. Fourteen Signs Announcing Christ’s Return. http://www.tomorrowsworld.org/booklets/fourteen-signs-announcing-christs-return/content viewed online 5/14/14).

Notice that LCG teaches that after Daniel 11:40-43 is fulfilled, that Daniel 11:31 will be fulfilled. This is a major problem because Daniel 11:31 is the sign that Jesus pointed to to warn that it would be time to flee and that the Great Tribulation was about to begin:

15 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let him who is on the housetop not go down to take anything out of his house. 18 And let him who is in the field not go back to get his clothes. 19 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! 20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Matthew 24:15-21)

For years I tried to work with LCG on this point as they had a publication written by John Ogwyn that agreed with the sequence that I have taught–that the King of the North invades the USA and Anglo-Saxon nations prior to the invasion of the King of the South. Thus LCG has two differing sequences that are in contradiction–which is confusing.

LCG also has the Great Tribulation beginning when the King of the North invades the King of the South. Here is what its Official Statement of Fundamental Beliefs teachings:

The Bible speaks of a time of great catastrophe, called the “Great Tribulation” (Matthew 24:21-22; Daniel 11:40-45; 12:1; Luke 21:19-36) (viewed 05/14/14)

LCG is teaching that Daniel 11:40 is the first item in the sequence in Daniel 11 to start the Great Tribulation. And this is a FUNDAMENTAL BELIEF, which is in error.

Notice that the old WCG taught something different. The late Herbert W. Armstrong wrote the following in 1979:

What is this abomination? This refers to Daniel 11:31 and Matthew 24:15…That will be a time when the UNITED Europe shall appear–the revival of the medieval “Holy Roman Empire.” We shall then be warned, and readied to be taken to a place of refuge and safety from the Great Tribulation. Forty-five days later “the beasts armies” will surround Jerusalem. Thirty days later the Great Tribulation will probably start with a nuclear attack on London and Britain–and possibly the same day or immediately after, on the United States and Canadian cities. The GREAT TRIBULATION, we shall fully then realize, is the time of “Jacob’s Trouble,” spoken of in Jeremiah 30:7. And Jacob’s name was named on Joseph’s sons, Ephraim and Manasseh (Gen. 48:16). At that time a third of the people in our nations will die, or shall have died, by famine and disease epidemics; another third will dies of the war–our cities being destroyed (Ezek. 6:6), and the remaining third will be carried to the land of our enemies as slaves (Ezek. 5:12). Armstrong HW. The Time We Are In, Now. Pastor General’s Report-Vol 1, No. 15, November 20, 1979, Page 2).

Notice that Herbert Armstrong has Daniel 11:31 first, then the USA and UK getting attacked (Daniel 11:39) (while it is true that the old Radio Church of God misunderstood the sequence originally, it changed decades ago–yet some never have understood the change and prefer to rely on an overridden tradition over the Bible).

Notice also something from the Plain Truth magazine in 1979:

King David of ancient Israel in a prophetic psalm (Psalm 83) provides additional insight into the Mideast picture. Germany (Assyria in Bible prophecy) and perhaps the rest of Europe will be in league in the future with a union of Arab nations–a vast confederacy bound together in an effort to crush out the name “Israel” from the face of the earth! This Arab-Moslem confederacy may very well be the previously mentioned “king of the south”–a sphere of power encompassing vast portions of the Islamic world.

“They have said, Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation; that the name of Israel may be no more in remembrance. For they have consulted together with one consent: they are confederate against thee: The tabernacles of Edom [Esau or modern-day Turkey, a non-Arab but Islamic nation], and the Ishmaelites [Saudi Arabia]; of Moab [part of Jordan], and the Hagarenes [anciently these peoples dwelt in the area known as Syria today]; Gebal [Lebanon], and Ammon [modern Jordan], and Amalek [part of the Turks]; the Philistines [the modern Palestinians] with the inhabitants of Tyre [Lebanon]; Assur [whose descendants, the Assyrians, migrated to Germany] also is joined with them: they have holpen the children of Lot [Jordan and Western Iraq]” (Psalm 83:4-8)…

But in the end, this European-Arab alliance will prove short-lived. As shown earlier, the “king of the north” of Daniel 11–the leader of the German-led European union–will ultimately turn against the Arab “king of the south,”…Daniel 11:40-41: And the king of the north shall come against him [the king of the south]…The Arab-Moslem Confederation will, of course, be thrown into chaotic disarray in the fact of invasion. (Stump K. The Arab World in Prophecy. Plain Truth, December 1979)

“Israel” in quotes above is a reference to the end time descendants of Israel, which includes the USA and Anglo-Saxon nations.

From no later than 1979 until the time of his death, Herbert Armstrong correctly taught that the Great Tribulation first begins with an attack by the European King of the North, not that the King of the North first invades the King of the South.

I tried to work with LCG on this for many years, and although they seem to have agreed (and at least once it was agreed in a meeting by one of their leaders that WCG had changed its view to the position I held by the 1970s; see also December 2011 Proposed changes to LCG’s Official Statement of Fundamental Beliefs), they never changed their publications to reflect this.

Since I was unable to get LCG to change while I was with it, despite agreements by its leaders to fix LCG’s errors on this point, hopefully pointing this error out again will assist them to correct it. Otherwise, this will be another area where those in LCG will misunderstand prophecy.

I would make a similar appeal to PCG, but as they improperly believe that Gerald Flurry is a prophet, nor have they ever agreed that I was correct on this, they seem less likely than LCG to consider this–but they ignore what the Bible teaches to their peril. Sadly this likely means, then, that they will not know when the Great Tribulation will begin, and that would then indicate they will not be protected from it.

The Apostle Paul taught:

15… I write so that you may know how you ought to conduct yourself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth. (1 Timothy 3:15)

On the prophetic sequence of Daniel 11, as well as on certain points of conduct, neither PCG nor LCG can be considered the “pillar and ground of the truth,” which is part of why neither hold the Philadelphia mantle.

There are many ramifications of the errors that they hold.

One to consider is that unless they change their positions, NEITHER PCG NOR LCG WILL REALIZE WHEN THE GREAT TRIBULATION WILL BEGIN AND THEIR SUPPORTERS WILL NOT FLEE TO BE PROTECTED IN A PLACE OF SAFETY IN THE WILDERNESS (Revelation 12:14-16). Their positions will be proven to be false.

We in the Continuing Church of God strive to always rely on the Bible over tradition: ” We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts” (2 Peter 1:19, KJV).

Will you truly rely on the more sure word of prophecy? Or traditions that will be proven to be false?

Some items of possibly related interest may include:

Is the Future King of the South Rising Up? Some no longer believe there needs to be a future King of the South. Might Egypt, Islam, Iran, Arabs, or Ethiopia be involved? Might this King be called the Mahdi or Caliph? What does the Bible say? A YouTube video of related interest may be: The Future King of the South is Rising.
The Arab and Islamic World In the Bible, History, and Prophecy The Bible discusses the origins of the Arab world and discusses the Middle East in prophecy. What is ahead for the Middle East and those who follow Islam? What about the Imam Mahdi? What lies ahead for Turkey, Iran, and the other non-Arabic Muslims? An item of possibly related interest in the Spanish language would be: Líderes iraníes condenan la hipocresía de Occidente y declaran que ahora es tiempo para prepararse para el Armagedón, la guerra, y el Imán Mahdi. Another article related to Iran translated into the Spanish language is: Irán y líderes israelíes discuten las intenciones nucleares de Irán.
Iran in Prophecy Is Iran in Bible prophecy? If so, what does the Bible teach? What names, other than Persia, may be used to describe Iran? There is also a YouTube video titled Iran in Prophecy. Here is a related video Iran In Prophecy.
Who is the King of the North? Is there one? Do biblical and Roman Catholic prophecies for the Great Monarch point to the same leader? Should he be followed? Who will be the King of the North discussed in Daniel 11? Is a nuclear attack prophesied to happen to the English-speaking peoples of the United States, Great Britain, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand? When do the 1335 days, 1290 days, and 1260 days (the time, times, and half a time) of Daniel 12 begin? When does the Bible show that economic collapse will affect the United States? In the Spanish language check out ¿Quién es el Rey del Norte? Here is a link to a video titled: The Future King of the North.
There is a Place of Safety for the Philadelphians. Why it May Be Petra This article discusses a biblical ‘place of safety’ and includes quotes from the Bible and Herbert W. Armstrong on this subject–thus, there is a biblically supported alternative to the rapture theory. There is also a video on the subject: Might Petra be the Place of Safety? Here is something related in the Spanish language: Hay un lugar de seguridad para los Filadelfinos. ¿Puede ser Petra?
Teachings Unique to the Philadelphia Church of God Simply calling oneself ‘Philadelphia’ does not make one so (see Revelation 3:7-9), nor does Gerald Flurry calling himself “that prophet” make it so. This article provides many quotes from this group which tries to look faithful.
What About the Living Church of God? Are there Doctrinal Differences with the Continuing Church of God? This article explains some information and doctrines of the Living Church of God as led by Roderick C. Meredith and some concerns about them. En el idioma español: ¿Qué hay acerca de la Iglesia de Dios Viviente? ¿Hay diferencias doctrinales con la Continuación de la Iglesia de Dios?
Why Bob Thiel Left the Living Church of God Several have speculated reasons, but here is the truth. (En el idioma español: ¿Por qué Bob Thiel dejó la Iglesia del Dios Viviente?)
How To Determine If Someone is a True Prophet of God There are many false prophets. How can Christians determine who is a true prophet? There is also a sermon-length video titled How to determine if someone is a true prophet of God. Here is a related link in Spanish/español: ¿Cómo determinar si alguien es un verdadero profeta de Dios?
When Will the Great Tribulation Begin? 2017, 2018, or 2019? Can the Great Tribulation begin today? What happens before the Great Tribulation in the “beginning of sorrows”? What happens in the Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord? Is this the time of the Gentiles? When is the earliest that the Great Tribulation can begin? What is the Day of the Lord? Who are the 144,000? Here is a version of the article in the Spanish language: ¿Puede comenzar la Gran Tribulación en 2016 o 2017? ¿Es el Tiempo de los Gentiles? You can also see the English language sermon videos: The Great Tribulation from the Mount of Olives and Can the Great Tribulation begin before 2020? A shorter video is: Will the Great Tribulation Start in 2017?
The ‘Peace Deal’ of Daniel 9:27 This prophecy could give up to 3 1/2 years advance notice of the coming Great Tribulation. Will most ignore or misunderstand its fulfillment?
The Philadelphia Church Era was predominant circa 1933 A.D. to 1986 A.D. The old Radio Church of God and old Worldwide Church of God, now the remnant of that era is basically the most faithful in the Church of God, like who hold to the beliefs and practices of the Continuing Church of God.
The Laodicean Church Era has been predominant circa 1986 A.D. to present. The Laodiceans are non-Philadelphians who mainly descended from the old WCG or its offshoots. They do not properly understand the work or biblical prophecies and will face the Great Tribulation if they do not repent.